Good summary of several red-flags in regards to using the Signal messenger.
Also interesting is this one.
Use a locally hosted XMPP with the Conversations client :)
Good summary of several red-flags in regards to using the Signal messenger.
Also interesting is this one.
Use a locally hosted XMPP with the Conversations client :)
I don’t really agree with all the hate against Signal. Signal is a good start into easy privacy for people, with an app (that I personally find better than What’s app).
Like it or not but the federated alternatives (even though I like them) are not as easy to use as Signal, I don’t think my grandparents could use XMPP as easily for example.
It’s far from perfect but I wouldn’t say it’s not trustworthy or a bad app though.
Well, yes to some extend. But it is again a walled garden and in the end anyone switching from WhatsApp is just in the same marginally improved situation again.
I also don’t think the “grandparents” argument is fair. If you register an account and install Conversations/Quicksy/Blabber.im on their phone it is just as easy to use. The bigger problem are the semi computer literate that you would expect to be able to install it themselves, but who give up on the first sign of a slight complication such as “what server should I chose?”.
The “grandparent” argument is fair. It’s fair to claim they will always revert to modern technology in their era which I assume, the analog telephone and fax machines. They’re not going to waste their time learning the next best thing anyway.
You totally missed my point. What I meant was that there is no difference in ease of use between Signal and Conversations/Quicksy once you have an account and it is installed on the phone. In fact XMPP is easier in some ways.
A grandparent isn’t going to be using a password manager let alone remember their credentials for a multitude of accounts or even if they did, they’d be using sticky notes on their monitors or fridge doors.
It may be easier for our generation to believe in the ease of use in technology but I think it’s a futile attemtpt to be passing off this knowledge upstream whom quite literally don’t care or can’t care enough.
No password manager is needed for XMPP. You set it up once and the password is stored in the app. In case you need to add another device, you can reset your password on many servers via email, just like any other website.
Signal on the other hand is tied to your phone number. Thus if you lose your phone or contract is cancelled, simcard breaks etc. your account is lost, unless you go through a pretty complicated procedure with your mobile phone company. And even then all your messages are lost as Signal isn’t multi-client (unlike XMPP).
I’m still discussing about our grandparents. I’ll break it down more succinctly: grandparents aren’t going to care about an online service/app security and features. They just want shit to work and all those extra steps we take for granted won’t necessarily be as productive for their generation.
Maybe you can automate the setup of xmpp or Signal with all the immediate members of their family but when something breaks, they’re not going to be tech savvy enough to troubleshoot.
Which is exactly why XMPP is the much better option for them once it is set up. Much less can go wrong and shit just works. Proven for nearly 20 years now. Yes, they will probably need some advise setting it up, but this is true for pretty much anything other than WhatsApp as well.
XMPP also works great on desktop computers with really old hardware… something that a lot of grandparents will surely appreciate.
Okay, good luck with that.
Signal’s plug and play.
Conversations app requires a sign up. We can’t miss out the ‘once you sign up’ bit - it’s an important step, because it stops users.
I’d prefer XMPP myself, but, my experience tells me this isn’t the best method. In a hostel people complained about privacy concerns. I told them about Signal. A few go to the PlayStore page and nearly clicked ‘Install’.
At this point a bigger privacy enthusiast told them not to download it, that it’s not decentralized, and to go and download new super-private thing and also add your own keys to a server here, and people just put down their phones without installing either.
If you would have showed them Quicksy or Blabber.im it would have been exactly the same as Signal, except that it would not be tied to a phone number, which some travelers in a Hostel might not have available, so in fact it would have been even easier.
I don’t read German.
https://blabber.im/en/, I think
I haven’t tried conversations but I bet it’s really simple to use. Element on android has gotten extremely simple to use just in the last few months, a much easier UI even than signal. I would def recommend either to a gran.
I agree with you. I life that in my environment.
Also I am not sure XMPP is made to work the same way Whatsapp or Signal does. Signal works with phone number, just the same way as whatsapp, it’s not made to be an anonymous chatting app, also XMPP doesn’t support audio and voice calls. I don’t know if there are decentralized alternatives to Whatsapp that works the same way.
But actually, yes, it’s sad that at any complication people just stops learning stuff believing it’s a too ‘geeky’ stuff for them.
XMPP does support audio and voice calls. All 3 of Conversations/Quicksy/Blabber.im do that. Furthermore, you can signup with your phone number exactly as in whatsapp/signal if you use Quicksy.
I recommend you try one of them out to see the current state of XMPP today before judging it :)
I think I am blind. I am using XMPP for some nice channels. But I never saw integrated voice and video though. I love XMPP but I wouldn’t say it’s as easy as Signal.
There are no voice channels as in Discord, but you can do voice and video calls with Conversations, Movim, Siskin and JSXC (with slight issues) all interoperable these days.
How do I do that with conversations? I can’t see the icon :(
The contact you want to call has to have a compatible client as well otherwise it does not show AFAIK. And your server might not be configured for STUN autodiscovery.
Check if your server is in this list. https://compliance.conversations.im/test/stun/
Second, any contact you wish to call must be both on one of the above servers and have a client that supports calling (such as the ones previously mentioned).
deleted by creator
Building yet another walled garden is a bit sketchy in itself and ultimately harms end users. It also harms other FLOSS projects simply by chipping away at their userbase and contributors.
Usability is not the only aspect to consider.