Are you trolling? Like seriously wth are you even talking about anymore? I said some vegans prefer vegan pets, as in bunnies and guinea pigs. You know what, just disengage at this point. You are wasting my time and not ready to talk about veganism.
… what?
Cats are currently fed very processed food recommended by veterinarians. They would rather you not feed your cat (or dog) homemade meals unless they have some serious digestive issues going on and is done with a vet’s instructions and directions. Some vegans might prefer vegan pets. Some vegans don’t like the idea of a pet. But I don’t think processed food is a part of opposition. You could even say processed food is a part of the vegan movement since you need vitamins met. Maybe you think processed food is unhealthy? I disagree with that notion but don’t feel like debating it rn.
Cats do not have the long digestive tracts of ruminants to efficiently ferment raw starch or fiber, but that doesn’t mean they cannot digest plant matter at all. It also does not mean they are unable to obtain any nutrients from plants or from fiber.
It IS possible for a cat to have a vegan diet as long as the essential nutrients are supplemented and you work with a vet. One big thing is taurine, but the way meat is processed in cat food removes the taurine so it is added back with synthetic taurine anyway.
You can read more about this in this thread:
https://lemmy.world/post/18691022
Also what is an obligate carnivore, does it mean they have to eat meat?
“Some carnivores, particularly cats (family Felidae), are obligate carnivores, meaning they cannot obtain all the nutrients that they need from the plant kingdom and bacteria. In particular, obligate carnivores lack the enzyme needed to split carotene, obtained from plants, into vitamin A. Instead, these animals obtain vitamin A from the liver of their prey. Obligate carnivores are similarly unable to synthesize some essential very-long-chain, highly unsaturated fatty acids that other animals can make from shorter fatty acids found in plant.”
So, an obligate carnivore is an animal that needs to (is obligated to) obtain some nutrients by eating the flesh of other animals (or those nutrients would have to be supplied in a form the cat can absorb by means of supplementation). Cats do not have the long digestive tracts of ruminants to efficiently ferment raw starch or fiber, but that doesn’t mean they cannot digest plant matter at all. It also does not mean they are unable to obtain any nutrients from plants or from fiber. However, being an obligate carnivore does mean that their diet MUST provide certain nutrients from the flesh of other animals or from supplementation.
https://rawfedandnerdy.com/what-is-an-obligate-carnivore
Studies on cats eating a vegan diet? Science says we need more studies because it is not as black and white as all the people kneejerking about it are saying.
Whilst the quality and amount of evidence needs to be considered in formulating recommendations, there was no overwhelming evidence of adverse effects arising from use of these diets and there was some evidence of benefits. It is, however, recommended that future high-quality studies, with standardized outcome measures and large sample sizes, be conducted. At the current time, if guardians wish to feed their companion animals vegan diets, a cautious approach should be taken using commercially produced diets which have been formulated considering the nutritional needs of the target species.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
I learned a lot by listening to the original commenters I linked above. Hope this helps.
Because the one thing a vegan community (meant specifically for vegans) needs is carnists coming in to troll everyone into debating them, it’s just a little dissent that totally won’t turn the community into a hostile environment /s
I’ve responded to this before and no one cared but here is the original thread since everyone has greatly exaggerated what was said about cats who are obligate carnivores not obligated to eat meat per se.
Thank you for posting this. I know now that it was because of voting which is ehh not as bad as I thought. But yeah IRL my family and partner aren’t very supportive, I’ve been trying to ignore their comments. It’s just hard sometimes, like just last night my partner said they felt sorry for me during dinner because I didn’t have meat in my meal. I think that’s probably why some vegans become more aggressive online as well as the cycle going on. Idk I just like reading articles and seeing recipes. When I first went vegan my dad tried getting my whole family to convince me to eat meat again. I love my dad but that sucked. I also love my partner and they are otherwise fine, but they seem to have a problem and are adjusting to my new diet. I can understand the fatigue a vegan may go through, but banning people for voting isn’t exactly what I had in mind as their rule 5.
Depends on the context maybe? Idk I am not a mod. I’ve just seen comments about arguing for eating meat or saying something like “I’m going to eat 2 hamburgers now because of you” which are just annoying. I thought that was what this was about. I’ll leave my comments up for anyone else confused.
Well yeah if seeing vegan content upsets you enough to break their rule 5 then it is not a good community for you. And that is ok, honestly I get grief in real life about me trying to be vegan. Having a place amongst other vegans and people not anti-vegan is nice. I also don’t know the context behind the post so if there is something I’m missing feel free to tell me.
Am I missing something here? The vegan community is for vegans and people to ask questions about being vegan but is not for debating about any part of being vegan. That is their rule 5, which I see people break every day thinking it is ok to shit all over vegans there. If you don’t want to hear about vegans then block the community.
It’s been infuriating seeing everyone’s reactions devolve into dunking on vegans about vegan cat food instead of the overreaction of Rookie. So I will say that it IS possible for a cat to have a vegan diet as long as the essential nutrients are supplemented and you work with a vet. One big thing is taurine, but the way meat is processed in cat food removes the taurine so it is added back with synthetic taurine anyway. Like just read the actual thread Rookie freaked out on. No one was saying only feed your cat vegetables and hope for the best.
https://lemmy.world/post/18691022
Also people using obligate carnivore but not understanding what it means. What is an obligate carnivore?
“Some carnivores, particularly cats (family Felidae), are obligate carnivores, meaning they cannot obtain all the nutrients that they need from the plant kingdom and bacteria. In particular, obligate carnivores lack the enzyme needed to split carotene, obtained from plants, into vitamin A. Instead, these animals obtain vitamin A from the liver of their prey. Obligate carnivores are similarly unable to synthesize some essential very-long-chain, highly unsaturated fatty acids that other animals can make from shorter fatty acids found in plant.”
So, an obligate carnivore is an animal that needs to (is obligated to) obtain some nutrients by eating the flesh of other animals (or those nutrients would have to be supplied in a form the cat can absorb by means of supplementation). Cats do not have the long digestive tracts of ruminants to efficiently ferment raw starch or fiber, but that doesn’t mean they cannot digest plant matter at all. It also does not mean they are unable to obtain any nutrients from plants or from fiber. However, being an obligate carnivore does mean that their diet MUST provide certain nutrients from the flesh of other animals or from supplementation.
https://rawfedandnerdy.com/what-is-an-obligate-carnivore
Studies on cats eating a vegan diet? Science says we need more studies because it is not as black and white as all the people kneejerking about it are saying.
Whilst the quality and amount of evidence needs to be considered in formulating recommendations, there was no overwhelming evidence of adverse effects arising from use of these diets and there was some evidence of benefits. It is, however, recommended that future high-quality studies, with standardized outcome measures and large sample sizes, be conducted. At the current time, if guardians wish to feed their companion animals vegan diets, a cautious approach should be taken using commercially produced diets which have been formulated considering the nutritional needs of the target species.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
I learned a lot by listening to the original commenters instead of circlejerking about vegans bad amirite. But I couldn’t possibly reply to every comment with this so I’ll leave it here instead. There is a reason I don’t use a Lemmy.world account, their moderation sucks.
Same but I went with proton.
I’ve seen only a few you listed like cowspiracy and seaspiracy and a majority of those two films were just facts and diagrams and interviews. So I call bullshit. I know this is a bad faith attempt I mean seriously, “impulsive highly emotional person”? Maybe people who care for the environment see the facts and diagrams and convert because it isn’t possible to feed this many people sustainably. It’s not a health disaster to be vegan either, that’s ridiculous of you to say. This won’t shock you because you came here to troll but vegans can go through pregnancy just fine, breast feed just fine too, something that shouldn’t be possible if it was such a health disaster. A lot of our food is already fortified with vitamins so you don’t need meat for b12 or iron, just eat a bowl of cereal with soy milk. I’m in the process of going vegan so not 100% but I’m so tired of seeing trolls come to vegan communities to talk about how much they don’t care about animals or the planet. And how manly and fulfilled it makes them feel to eat bacon. We get it, you’re boring and have nothing new to say.
CW: child abuse, abortion, sexual assault, suicidal ideation
I think if a fetus has an abnormality the parents don’t want, then they can choose to abort once it is caught. But once the infant is born, the parents shouldn’t be able to back out. I don’t have children, I might have them one day, so I don’t know if I’ll ever change my mind if I end up having a kid with a serious disability that wasn’t caught in time for an abortion. There are some conditions where the kid doesn’t even survive childhood. That sounds really heartbreaking but I couldn’t bring myself to basically kill a child.
I am physically and mentally disabled myself and it has been a struggle. I haven’t had kids yet because my disability has made me permanently low income and I don’t know if I have the strength and energy to raise a child. I am female so I would be carrying and birthing the baby and breastfeeding and all that jazz, unmedicated because my medication causes birth defects. There are times I want to die, I find myself drifting towards researching suicide methods. But it is my choice, it should never be anyone else’s. Certainly not my asshole parents’ decision.
I would like to say that if a parent wants to back out, the kid can go to a loving home in foster care. However, foster care is very bad in my area and I’ve heard very tragic tales from children that end up in their care. I don’t know why, I don’t know if it is a budgeting issue, but abusive foster parents in my area with clear mental and anger problems are allowed to foster anyway as well as typical abusive religious nutjobs. My parents were pretty abusive to me, one was the narcissistic abuser and the other was the enabler. I have PTSD from them and so do my siblings. And yet we ended up better than the foster kids I’ve heard from. I still would advocate for fixing the foster care system rather than killing all those children. My parents told me if I called CPS, I would be raped in foster care. It scared me enough to keep quiet about the abuse. Turns out it does happen, I know kids that went through that, and it is fucked up. I’m not saying every foster kid goes through this but I would never take that chance with my own kid. Adoption is not an option for me.