Personally I think not having karma limits is nice currently! I understand why they were used but grinding karma as a lurker on reddit was frustrating.
The comment “This” is annoying to me. Just use the upvote button!
This.
This
This!
Upvoted and this’d
🤔
Yea that seems like something that started showing up more as time went on and more users joined. The trends and jokes did get tiring.
And my axe!
🙄
This. I usually try to avoid commenting just “This” and try to give more explanation why I’m saying that. Feel like that’s the proper way of doing it.
Personally I am commenting and posting much more now than ever on reddit. I want to transition to lemmy and see it grow as I refuse to use the Android reddit app.
I am not typing/imagining a comment and then not posting it here either like many people do on reddit. It seems like a good time to become less of a lurker.
Agreed, especially with how new Lemmy is, it just really feels like it needs our engagement to succeed and get more people to join.
I remember when I first got on reddit, it was still bigger than lemmy is now, but it still felt small enough that commenting actually felt worthwhile. Definitely excited to be here. Tryna engage as much as possible so people feel there’s a community to join
If I’m not mistaken, because lemmy by default sorts comments by newest, if you comment something more users will see it, but on reddit it’ll get stuck at the bottom.
Yeah. Honestly I’m way more active here. Granted my whole time on the fediverse is like a week or two, but Ive made more comments today than I have in like a decade on reddit. I could easily see myself not returning to reddit.
The comment “this” comes from sites that don’t have votes. The equivalent here is voting. It really is that simple.
Add back the hardcoded slur filter but just for these kind of comments
This tbh
Agree. Kind of relatedly, anyone know what boost does versus an upvote?
Assuming they use Mastodon terminology it likely means the same thing as a retweet.
(For anyone confused, OP’s using kbin, not Lemmy)
Nazis.
This is the big one
Yeah, fuck Nazis!
No, that’s how they reproduce! Isolate them! Or at least use a condom.
Hah. It’s probably gonna be worse here.
They main instances have taken strong stances against nazi shit. The Lemmy developers are leftwing communists even, and they run lemmy.ml, so I don’t think defederating from servers who’ll platform nazis is unlikely.
I doubt that any instance I’d be interested in being a part of would federate with nazi communities. They’d end up more isolated than on Reddit.
This is why I love the idea of Federation. You can give them their own space to shout and fling their faeces as much as they want but absolutely nobody is required to give them an audience.
You mean you don’t want an algorithm hawking them into your face after your look up a recipe?
Nah, they are going to their own rathole.
Yes, fuck them, by the root and stem.
My thought as well.
Yeah, but actual Nazis. Not “you disagreed with me or voted for someone I don’t like so I’m going to call you a Nazi.”
This user doth protest too much, methinks
Reddit has a longstanding reputation for being a hive of scum and villainy (like hosting the_donald for years, or kotakuinaction, etc). I really hope that Lemmy keeps with the general left-leaning vibes of the fediverse overall, hopefully being a good space for queer people, women, people of colour, etc.
I think you do have to be careful here though. If you’re too permissive you allow bigotry, but if you’re too restrictive you cut off honest, good faith debate and create echo chamber silos where beliefs are never challenged.
Bigotry should never be accepted but that means non-discriminatory opinions, especially ones you disagree with, should be allowed.
Good faith is the key here. I’m all for disagreements leading to lengthy discussions and even some controversy as long as everyone is arguing in good faith.
I can’t stand trolling, outright bigotry, and the normalization of literal fascist opinions as a mere “disagreement”. If a “disagreement” (you know which ones I mean) will lead to people dying if enabled, I’m pretty happy keeping those ideas out.
Gender critical ideas are based on truth and reality. If those ideas are censored here that would be terrible.
That’s the beautiful thing about being a federated platform. You can create your own island and fill it with all the hatred and bad “science” you want. it’s worked for the British for centuries.
No hatred here. Just leave the kids and women spaces alone.
Hi! I’m trans. If you’re looking to change your mind about that I’m happy to chat! Otherwise I suggest you look to get out of here as soon as possible.
Hi! I’m gender critical. If you’re looking to change your mind about that I’m happy to chat! Otherwise I suggest you look to get out of here as soon as possible.
I’ve never understood the need to militantly oppose others’ personal situations when they have no impact on your own. Even playing devil’s advocate - what is the point of the hate? You don’t believe in gender identity, then don’t personally be trans. The fact that others may be would seem to have literally zero impact on you or your life. Why should Lemmy accommodate negativity that does real harm to people in sensitive circumstances?
Who decides whats non-discriminatory.
/r/jailbait needed a spotlight in the national news from Anderson Cooper to get dealt with.
But (allowing for the fact that I’m still learning) by its nature I’m not sure the fediverse can stop these things in total, but the particular instances you subscribe to can. I’m unclear if INDIVIDUALS can ban instances (as far as I can tell they cannot) which I think might be a good addition. But instances can ban other instances, and eventually the fediverse will figure out which instances to put in the time-out corner for the rest of us, I think. But it will take time and might be a bit of wack-a-mole.
I think this is the big thing that Fediverse platforms are missing right now. If you want to be able to ban instances yourself, you have to run your own.
That would be nice but these platforms with “instances” look like it’s a Reddit on steroids. I don’t see how a community could be shut down with the way it’s setup currently. I’m a complete newbie though so don’t rely on my unprofessional observations.
Your instance can ban the offending instances, so they won’t show up for you or your fellow users, and vice versa. It provides a good way to exile the offending community.
Do you know how the report button works?
Does it send a report to the mods of your instance?
I honestly have no idea. I’m just running my own instance so I’ll just ban any users from my federation feed if I need to.
If you check the modlog page (link at the bottom of the desktop site), you can see what mods/admins have been doing recently (note that there is potentially offensive content there)
Communities can’t be shut down, but they can be shut out. This is also just true in life in general.
If The_Donald were to set up shop on Lemmy.ml, they could ban the instance and the members, but they could just turn around and join another instance.
So, what do you do then? Site admins can ban the remote instance, and they can put pressure on the hosting site admins by threatening to defederate.
Let’s say the new hosting site’s admin gives into defederation pressure and also bans the instance and its members. We’ll, then those people can set up their own server. Now, the admin won ban them.
But none of the major servers will federated with them. They’ll be alone on their low population fashy instance (or not so low population - Truth Social is suppsoey the biggest Mastodon instance), effectively quarantined.
That’s the best anyone can do. That’s true with or without Lemmy.
So you want censorship of opinions you disagree with? Sounds pretty fascist tbh.
When those views call for the dehuminization of others or are based on false information, yes.
Consider opening up a window and letting CO2 out
So you want censorship of opinions you disagree with?
Yes.
So you want censorship of opinions you disagree with?
Yes.
Posting pictures too much, including pictures of tweets or pictures of news headlines.
Please link to the fucking article.
Yes! Many sumbreddits that actually had a point and were dare-I-say educational quickly became just twitter sceencap platitudes, on repeat.
I get it, easy to read and agree with and upboat, but ultimately just dumbing the place down to the lowest common denominator and burying anything with effort or insight.
Mods who are running 10 major subreddits. It gives them too much power to steer opinions.
The shadow cabal that ran Reddit
It’s honestly crazy that these random ass mods had the power to actually influence the views of millions
Lol as Reddit management will soon find out (we hope)
The awkward turtle…
Can’t wait for the screenshot of a Reddit post of a Lemmy post of an Instagram post about Elon tweeting some shit.
Oh God please
god doesn’t do this kind of stuff, maybe ask someone else uwu
i want this :))
Upvote/downvote counts mangling. Just show the real numbers, don’t mess with them with an unknown “algorithm”.
As far as I can see, the real number is already on top of the post. And then you have the split of up/downvotes near the arrows. So the “algorithm” is just basic addidion and subtraction. Someone correct me if I saw something wrong…
I think they’re referring to what Reddit did with not showing them separately
Getting banned in one subreddit you never participated in for daring to have a comment (regardless of the content of that comment) in another subreddit.
I see the same shit in the Fediverse though. Mastodon admins blocking a server just because they refused to participate in a shared block list.
Someone’s going to make a script to ban a non-local user based on your remote posts, I guarantee it.
Isn’t the federated model specifically designed as a solution to undesired moderation? If a server is ban happy, users won’t go there. Problem solved?
The fact that opening a new instance still requires some technical knowledge is a difficulty facing the fediverse, since the venn diagram of people with the time and know-how to manage server administration and people who are knowledgeable on community moderation aren’t always two concentric circles.
But that’s not a task that is asked of a general user, even if their goal is to switch servers. If you don’t like gmail, the solution for an individual is almost never to start your own email server.
Correct. What i’m saying is that since federated networks tend to be more community run initiatives, moderators are gonna be people from within the community and the final say on moderation issues is gonna come from those who understand how the fediverse works and have done the work of setting up the servers that everyone is using. Which I’m sure can and has worked for plenty of Mastodon and Lemmy instances out there, but I’m sure there’s also instances where the head admin simply went haywire one day and nuked everything. It’s not that the system can’ work, it’s just that it isn’t really designed to gravitate towards experienced trust and safety experts being the ones that important decisions fall upon.
I feel like I should clarify that I have nothing against any Lemmy mods or admins. They’re all being cool and helpful with onboarding reddit refugees like myself. I just think that this is an important thing to think about if we want this place to support more and more people and a growing number of communities in the future.
I get you. But I’ve seen far too many users doing exactly this (starting their own mail server) in my programming circles. It doesn’t fare well tbh.
Which is important if you don’t want the Fediverse to become the next Voat.
Can you please explain?
Proactively banning problematic users before they cause issues is necessary. Prevention is better than cure.
Ah, the old guilt by association groupthink.
This is a ridiculous response. I think autobanning people who common “killthejews@ss.gov” is probably a good idea.
You’re making a strawman argument and putting words in my mouth.
What mastodon server(s)?
gatekeeping, censorship, shadowbans from commenting in a different community, echo chambers.
Shadowbans especially. Either ban a post or not, but don’t make the poster think everyone can still see it without explanation.
The Fediverse already has these, there are lots of echo chamber instances that automatically block other instances for simply federating with the “wrong” instance (equivalent to those AutoMod bans on Reddit for posting in a certain subreddit). Since instance admins pay for their instances out of pocket, they are more restrictive with their instance’s allowed content than social media websites that want to cast the widest net. Eventually, there will be a massive split between communities, like how conservative and progressive Mastodon instances all block each other. Centrists can just have an account on each side of the wall.
Mod culture is always odd to me. I kind of wish there was more community modderation, and less dictators for life running things.
I know with mine that’s the approach I’m taking. Let the community dictate rules rather than power tripping mods
What’s your community?
I run an instance for all things pop music! From Madonna to Taylor Swift, if you like pop music you have a home with us! poptalk.scrubbles.tech
I can’t think of a subject I have less interest in but I love that we’re actually seeing all kinds of communities pop up here.
Looking at their profile, it’s probably !taylorswift@poptalk.scrubbles.tech
Definitely a problem that comes with reddit and the unique subreddit names I’d say. I feel like that may not be avoided here since moving many subscribers from a large->small community is so difficult. Maybe the federation style will be successful though, I can’t say I have enough experience to predict that well.
To be honest, I don’t think that’s entirely just a Reddit thing. Power tripping mods have been around as long as Internet forums have in general. It’s a tough one to combat for sure.
As have complaints about legitimate mods from people who got banned. It is a complex issue even just to get the facts of the matter. Maybe some sort of public log of all mod messages and actions would help with that but then one would have to ensure that the people who like the deleted messages don’t just use the mod log as their new place to spread the content.
As a new community we need to identify and stamp out bad actors immediately and thoroughly (spammers, selfservers, ads disguised as posts, brigading, illegal content, racism, you get the idea).
We can’t control if they create their own instances, but we can isolate them.If Lemmy truly catches on we probably can’t totally prevent an Eternal September, but I do hope we go a long way to staving it off.
this seems to be a good place to mention avoiding groupthink and trendy opinions. more fresh diverisity and bold independent thinkers.
a flood of general americans would be worse than cultivating a niche counterculture initial userbase.
Bullshit moderation.
Reddit was so full of hateful shit. Reddit’s AEO (Anti Evil Operations, basically the admins personal “mod team”, probably outsourced to some country with lacking English skills) would continue to tell me that the most blatant hateful comments do not violate Reddit’s ToS. Meanwhile, you get (perma) banned for the most ridiculous & mundane things at times, like saying that a fascist Italy should get kicked out of the EU & NATO. Apparently this is considered “spreading hate” and they even denied my appeal, explaining that both institutions require the members to be democratic. Meanwhile all the racism on subs like /r/europe would go unpunished. I also tried to report similar comments to mine as hate, but containing less popular countries like Turkey, and unsurprisingly they also didn’t see it as hate.Getting harassed by other users that reply on all your comments & follow you around? Nope, no violation.
Questioning the title & picture relation of a governmental account? Apparently harassment / bullying worth a 7 day ban.
Calling out dehumanization? Perma ban in a sub.
Perma ban in a sub? Perma ban in another sub for complaining about it, for “ban evasion”.
Speaking out against predatory monetization methods & FOMO tactics in modern video games? Getting attacked & insulted by users and consequently perma banned for being “an asshole troll” - none of the attacks & insults were removed, let alone punished.What isn’t a violation? Racism, transphobia, homophobia, calls for violence, etc.
In regards to big hate subs it is also mostly the case that Reddit only goes and does something against them when there’s some sort of media attention around it. When it directly affects their potential income. Maybe if advertisers start to complain about it.The enforcement of the rules is so random at this point that I don’t even know what one is allowed to say, or why I even should care about accounts and the platform as a whole. I understand that moderation of big platforms is not an easy task, but one surely can do better than whatever the hell Reddit is doing nowadays.
In regards to specifically Lemmy I would say they aren’t up to a good start with the controversial admin team and their extremist views.
The nice thing about federation is that you can always go somewhere else if you disagree with a particular instance.
Lemmy’s devs have questionable politics at best. IMO, I don’t care as long as it doesn’t impact how they run the site - people have a right to their own opinions, as long as those opinions don’t harass or hurt others directly.
But let’s say they changed one day. Maybe one day they added something to the code forcing everyone to praise the CCP or else.
Because the software is open-source - people could fork it before the change. It’s out there already. People can totally make their own little variants of Lemmy with added features, if that’s something they wanted to do. You can modify the code yourself and then self-host the modified version. No matter what Lemmy’s devs do… they have no power on your instance. A fork means you own the code.
I’ve seen the sentiment tossed around that it’s unethical to use Lemmy because if you donate to the project (or contribute to donations towards the project) you are financing people who have bad politics. That’s your prerogative. I personally disagree - again, as long as your politics aren’t actively contributing to harassment/harm you shouldn’t be punished for them - but I understand the sentiment.
To that, I say - well, there’s other options. That’s the beauty of the Fediverse - you don’t have any Musk or Spez that comes along to ruin everything. I’m on Kbin, which I like a lot. The dev is a great guy, and I really like how it combines the best of Lemmy and Mastodon.
Even if you want to stay on Lemmy, there are wonderful communities on Lemmy that disagree with the direction of the devs. Beehaw is a great place with a fantastic mod team, for example. You can donate to Beehaw’s devs and know it’s going to keep Beehaw running, and it’s not the same as supporting Lemmy directly.
Because the software is open-source - people could fork it before the change. It’s out there already. People can totally make their own little variants of Lemmy with added features, if that’s something they wanted to do. You can modify the code yourself and then self-host the modified version. No matter what Lemmy’s devs do… they have no power on your instance. A fork means you own the code.
People are already doing so, right now. AFAIK Lemmy by default doesn’t have the ability to disable downvoting, yet Beehaw and the instance I’m on (among others, probably) do have downvoting disabled.
Wow, thank you for this post. Doing some reading on Lemmy’s devs’ attitude toward human rights, and… I think I’ll check out Kbin. Thanks again, I had no idea!
I got a warning for saying the words “kill yourself” in the context of a video game discussion where someone killed their own character to kill a streamer’s character in the perma death mode. The method used was an ability that links 2 characters together and if one of them dies, they both die. There was some change made to prevent this in the future so i said something along the lines of “you could still kill yourself trough other means, i don’t see how this solves the issue” and got a site wide warning with no way to appeal
By that metric, everyone that used LowTierGod meme should have been banned, which is half of reddit at this point.
What’s the story about the Lemmy admins? Hadn’t heard anything about that.
I’ve been on lemmy for about three years and the admins have been phenomenal. The interactions I’ve had and seen with them have been well-reasoned and positive.
I can’t speak for whether it’s true or not, but the answer I’ve seen is that they’re tankies, or associated with that crowd in some way.
Oh you were on a roll with this one but crashed right into a corner at the end there, lol.
Realized another - the awards that reddit created were out of control. I didn’t mind avatars too much since customization can be fun and it was optional, but the awards are spammed and shown on most reddit clients.
I actually support awards here with the option of hiding them, i think it’d be a good, relatively ethical way to monetize lemmy.
funding is better than monetizing a platform
It could be in cool (in the future) to have a donate button instead, so to support users who are posting great content
On the other hand, donating to lemmy should be separate (the way it is now) and not a cut of those donations to users
I always thought it would be cool if awards meant something, like a donation to an NGO of the user’s choosing (from a list of 20 or so to reduce complexity). Lemmy could be one of the options but not the only option (like it was for Reddit) that the money would go to. I feel like more people would buy and give awards if that were the case.
Like integrating a PayPal/ Kofi tool kind of?
I felt the move of making reddit silver a real award was a big shift. Newer users don’t even get why reddit silver was a thing.
I do like the idea of optional visibility - awards certain;y don’t have to be bloat/bad.
Reddit Silver being an award just completely stole all the magic out of it. It was a cute little memey way to show support and make fun of Reddit Gold and then it got turned into a way to put more money in Reddit’s pocket :c
I remember Reddit Gold being controversial when it was new.
deleted by creator
Yeah that’s a really good point. Maybe a portion of the award funds for a given post could go to that post’s creator’s server and a portion to a pooled fund for all servers/servers reaching capacity?
Of course this and any other ideas re monitising should be carefully thought out re perverse incentives 😬
Awards were fine when there was only three of them: gold, silver, platinum. Once they added twenty billion, all meaning the awards once had were lost, especially since many of them were given to users for free when they were once paid only.
- Karma penalty limits
- Reposts
Reposts! The same 20 jokes being reposted on r/funny to the point that they’re no longer funny.
You don’t want reposts? How about 15 different c/funny communities across 15 different instances each with the exact same reposts.
I assume all those different communities are eventually going to be assimilated into 1 or 2 communities. Those that lack subscribers will eventually die out organically.
Me too. I just hope the algorithm will be smart enough to only show me those communities on my front page. Right now it is showing me everything and I have no idea if there’s any real algorithm deciding what shows up.
